Bagshot Heath
The borough of which Bagshot forms a part (the borough also includes Camberley, Frimley, Windlesham, and Lightwater among other places) is justifiably called "Surrey Heath". Here we have two views within the Bagshot parish. The first is classic local heath with heather on a sandy soil - and equally classic are the encroaching silver birch trees trees and sometimes fir trees. This particular picture was taken towards the NW corner of the parish.
The trees are a real problem for they change the habitat and deprive butterflies and other fauna of their natural environment. Fir trees are an even bigger problem for they kill off everything under their canopy and the acid in their fallen needles even changes the very composition of the soil. From time to time volunteer "conservation work parties" help - at first sight it seems odd that the prime activity is rooting out and burning trees, but that is the only way to preserve the original habitat once trees have become established. Elsewhere in Surrey I have known controlled grazing of heathland to be reintroduced in order to maintain the traditional plant growth..
Areas of the heath also suffer from illegal off-road driving. The Heathland Conservation Society has been established in order to apply pressure and provide practical action to prevent further damage and to reverse the damage done in the past. This link to Google maps should take you to an aerial photo of part of the heath. These images were taken about 2000 and the white scaring is all due to off-road riding. Since then such activity has become illegal, and although the damage is recovering, people still flout the law.
The heath extends on both sides of the A30 to the west of Bagshot. On old maps "Bagshot Heath" is marked predominantly to the southwest on what is now called Lightwater Country Park with the area to the northwest being marked in much small writing. Over time that has changed with the north side of the A30 having the predominant name until now the area south of the A30 is seldom described as Bagshot Heath.
Ron writes:
When I was a child in the war years, the Common started where Lightwater "The Close" road and houses are now. Then the timber firm "Montigue Mayer" built a sawmills and fenced an area of appox 400 x 400 yards off. You could walk a path beside that fence to the rear of the Lightwater cemetery to join a track at the top of the Avenue, which divided to go to High Curly hill or to the lake.Various smaller tracks led to the water tower area, where many chestnut trees grew.
The common from the top of High Curly was used by the Army, mostly for Brengun carriers (small tracked vehicles) and we kids would wave them to stop and give us a ride. Great fun but very bumpy ride.
The common extended from Red Road to Waterers nursery (A30) and to the Deepcut to Jolly Farmer road (the Maultway). The heath land would catch fire most years and the fire service would draw water from the lake, sometimes emptying it to expose the foundations of a house under the lake. ref 612.0206
David Kell contributed:
I remember as a boy going up to Bagshot Heath to watch motorbike scrambles - they used to be on Saturdays and Sundays. Before that they used to test tanks up there. The bike track was very long stretching from the water tower right over to Curly Hill .I also used to do a paper round for Mr Lewis at Lighwater right up as far as Curly Hill and starting in the Guildford Road by the shop which was at the other end of the village. About 250 papers used to take from about 6 in the morning till about 10 o'clock. I had to balance them on the handle bars as there were so many. I have got lots of memories about Lightwater and Bagshot to many to put down but I do rember the highlight of the year in Lightwater was a day trip to Bogner with the Working Men's Club. About 8 coaches used to go - we allways stopped at Bury Hill where crates of liquid refreshment was drunk by our dads! [xx]
I'm researching military Field cooking. I'm aware that the Army held a Training camp on Chobham Common in 1853. This due to concerns over Russian activity, which lead to the Crimean war.
In an article in the Illustrated London News of 1853, it reports of a similar camp being held at Bagshot Heath in 1798. I presume this to be a training event prior to the Napoleonic wars. Sadly, this is many years before the Illustrated London News was set up. I wonder what clippings / Newspaper articles might be held by anyone on this event?
My webpage on cooking needs updating, but research is on my Stolly website [Oct 24]
Below is an area of mature deciduous woodland just south of the A30. Travel a little further south and it again becomes open heathland.
Common or Crown land?
One of my correspondents, Richard, writes: I was distinctly under the impression, back in the mid 50's when I lived in Bagshot, that when we used to go and chop our Christmas trees down on Bagshot Heath that we were on 'Common' land in the Doomsday Book sense of the word - and that it was free land to be enjoyed by all. I see to my horror now that there has been a gradual encroachment of gates on the pathways leading from Vicarage Road the newest one now being right at the very start of the dirt road. Anyone know the exact status of the heath? Or does the logging company money speak louder than the ancient rights of the 'commoner'?
Alan, a former Bagshot resident, replied: Bagshot Heath was always known as common land - called Poors Allotments by my family and had a group of Trustees - what has happened to this? We always roamed the heath as children in the 50s and 60s. I know there was a big uproar when the GPO tower was planned and people saw this as taking common land away
I was told the land had been left to the people of Bagshot in perpetuity - I wonder who administers the land now ? Crown land was always fenced off . The Camberley site talks of the land being included with Old Dean Common now.
The late June Green, then chairman of the Windlesham United Charities and Poors Allotments clarified the situation : The Poors Allotments is NOT common land but privately owned charity land. The site covers about 180 acres and is a fish-shaped area sandwiched between the Crown Estate to the east and the MoD land to the west. If you look at the OS map you will see the fish shape, aligned northwest-southeast, with the tail of the fish to the north (including the reservoir) and the "mouth" to the southwest (the BT tower forms an "eye" for the fish) bordering the unmade section of College Ride. This land was set aside under the Enclosure Awards in the early 1800s to allow poor people in the old ecclesiastical parish of Windlesham (which includes Lightwater and Bagshot as well as Windlesham) to go there and gather fuel (bracken, turves). Those rights still exist.
The land is administered by the Trustees of Poors Allotments and today the Trustees use income from past land sales, which has been invested, to distribute winter fuel grants to people in Bagshot, Windlesham and Lightwater. Notices are put up in post offices inviting people to apply for fuel grants. The closing date for applications is usually October 31. Applicants must have lived in the parish for two years and grants are only given to people on low incomes. The Trustees also administer the James Butler Almshouses (on the Meade Court site) in Bagshot. Trustees are appointed by Windlesham Parish Council and serve a four-year term.
Any off-road motorcyclists reading this please note: You DO NOT have permission to ride on this land and face prosecution if you are caught. 7028.307xxx
There are residual fences in places, but the Crown land is now for the most part accessible. The whole area of more-or-less open country extends from Sandhurst across to the Bagshot Park estate and to the untutored eye it would be hard to discern just what is actually what.
Heathland Conservation
David, a member of the Heathland Conservation Society (see above), has contributed this. ref 898.706
In answer to the concerns about the site being "closed off" : this is purely to try to stop cars and motorbikes from entering the site. The whole area to Bracknell is open to ramblers and cyclists with a permit. The only exception is the land going down towards Sandhurst where military manoeuvres still take place. The Poors Allotment land which "belongs" to Bagshot is the 200 acres on the plateau South West of the observation tower. This is where the Heathland Conservation Society is working to restore the Heathland which once defined Bagshot. The land beside the continuation of College Ride and most of the forestry land belongs to the Crown Estate and the rest is army land. Hence the whole area has the following organisations with various responsibilities for differing parts;
- The Army with a ranger who seems to cover most of the army land in SE England,
- The Crown Estate with rangers also covering other crown land,
- Trustees of Poors Allotments,
- The Forestry Commission,
- Surrey Heath Borough Council,
- Bracknell Borough Council,
- Surrey Police,
- Thames Valley Police,
- English Nature who supposedly manage the whole area as a high conservation area - a site of Special Scientific Interest ,but unfortunately English Nature is being disbanded by HMG and is due to be replaced by Natural England - so at present is inactive and starved of funds.
Ideally the area should be designated as a Nature reserve with its own ranger supported by the council. The little we (the Conservation Society) do seems rather pathetic but important nevertheless
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Habitation and Industry on the Heath
Writing of the 1960's Mark says : "We used to play on Bagshot Heath and there was a place called 'Granny Coles' a little tree lined dell with an old apple tree; perhaps once a habitation. Does anyone know anything about the history of Granny Coles?"
Alan adds: I have never been able to find out anything about Granny Coles. I too used to play on the the site in the 50s and 60s, I am surprised no-one seems to have heard of her. My mother did say, however that she was bitten by an adder. The adjacent hill was known as Clarkes Hill after a one-armed soldier who lived in a hut there. There was also a site nearby known as Granny Baine's. A small community obviously lived there, maybe poor people.
I recall once seeing a photo from the local museum of a shack on the heath, I think it was described as a dwelling of a tinker or perhaps broom cutter. This would have been very early 1900's. So perhaps Alan has pointed us in the right direction and these names originated with people who once lived on the heath and then hung on in the folk lore of the local children long after the people died and the dwellings disappeared.
Eleanor cleared up the Granny Coles mystery for us:
My husband's great grandmother was Granny Coles and she and her
husband, who was a broom maker, lived on the heath for many years.
Information and photographs can be found in the museum in Camberley and
the staff can tell you all about this family. 7012.207
Mary Bennett (until recently assistant curator in the museum in
Camberley) has written a book with the title, Life and Work on Surrey
Heath published by Phillimore. 608
Eleanor adds : I am interested
in tracing any descendants of William and Mary Cole who resided on the
Poors Allotment. My husband is grandson of the youngest member of this
family Charles Edward Cole. Charles had one brother William and several
sisters. The eldest sister was Elizabeth who became Mrs Searle and had
a daughter Sarah Ann. Other sisters were named Ann, Sarah, Rose, Jane
and Selina. Sarah married John Page 7 Jan 1882 and Selina married John
Taylor 14 May 1882. Does anyone know about any of these please?[Jun
07]
If any readers wish to know more I'd be pleased to answer any
questions. [May 14]
Sue writes that in the 1881 Census Joseph Grainger and his family are recorded as dwelling at Poors Allotment, Windlesham. Joseph gives his occupation as a Master Chimney Sweep. 7042.407
June confirms that there are photographs of broom dashers' cottages in Surrey Heath Museum. There were several families living on the allotments, and the trustees were charging them rent, but the only family whose name is known to the present trustees are the Coles. There is also a lovely photograph of two rather grubby Bagshot ladies in Surrey Heath Museum who were chimney sweeps. One of them I think was named Tot and I believe they were sisters. I wonder if they could they be related to the Grainger family? 7028.407
Lesley asks "Is the area known as "Granny Coles" opposite the Bird in Hand pub? My grandfather grew up in Bagshot in the 1920s and as a child used to play on land opposite the Bird in Hand pub. One day someone told him that he and his brothers could play on this land any time that they wanted as the land was owned by their family. This memory has stayed with my grandfather and puzzled him over the years, as no-one else ever made reference to the land being owned by his family. He moved away from Bagshot when he was a teenager. His name is Maurice Taylor and his father's name was Sidney Taylor. Perhaps they are related to the John and Selina Taylor mentioned? Feb10
There is an article about the heath, the Enclosure Act and the Cole family here
Prior material about PoW camps on Old Dean Common & Cobham Common has been moved here.
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